UPDATED: D161 Board Votes to Close Mary Drew Elementary School
After a fierce debate among members, the Summit Hill school board approved closing the elementary school for 2012-13 in a 4-3 vote.
- By Joe Vince
- Email the author
- February 22, 2012
- UPDATED (12:47 p.m. Thursday, Feb. 23)
Only a couple hours after Mary Drew Elementary School students gave presentations before its members, the Summit Hill School District 161 board voted 4-3 to close the school as part of its ongoing budget-cutting process.
Two weeks ago, the board changed course with its three-year financial plan, voting to keep the full-day kindergarten program after deciding to drop it during a budget workshop earlier this month.
After the vote, board president Mary Kenny asked that discussion concerning the possibility of closing one to two district schools in the 2012-13 school year be put on the agenda for the Wednesday, Feb. 22, meeting.
Who Voted Against It and Why
Board members Sean William Doyle, George Perros and Stacey Borgens voted against the closing, saying more time and information was needed before taking the action of closing a school.
During the meeting, Doyle and Perros strongly contended that the board--and the community--needed more specific facts before it decided to close Mary Drew or any school. Perros questioned what the exact plans were for what to do with Mary Drew once it was closed, as well as requesting exact numbers on how much would be saved by shuttering it.
LIVE BLOG: Click on the Blog Above to Read the Transcript of Last Night's Events
"Are we going to rent it, sell it, mothball it?" Perros said. "Generalities are one thing, but I don't think we've done the specific research. ... I have not seen the data that says we need to close a school now."
Perros also questioned why Mary Drew was chosen, given how well the school had performed on state tests. He also asked why older schools, such as Arbury Hills or Indian Trails, weren't considered, saying Indian Trails faces about $1 million in repair work.
Although built in 1974, Mary Drew was renovated three years ago. It also faces about $600,000 in roof repair work, said board Vice President Joy Murphy.
Earlier in week, Doyle and Perros gave Supt. Barb Rains alternative budget cuts to look at that would keep all the schools open, while providing the district the savings it needed. But Kenny said many of those cuts were already factored in under the board's streamlining model. Of the remaining reductions, Kenny said they weren't enough to reach the board's goal of cutting $1.4 million for 2012-13.
Who Voted For It and Why
Board President Mary Kenny, board Vice President Joy Murphy, board Secretary Denise Lenz and board member Denise Wildeveld voted to close Mary Drew, with the understanding that the board needs to cut "big-ticket items" if its going to reduce its deficit.
"I didn't want to do it, but we had to do something," said Murphy, who supported cutting the full-day kindergarten first before closing a school. "We owe it to the taxpayers."
The board chose Mary Drew on the recommendation of Rains, Murphy said. Arbury Hills and Frankfort Square elementary schools also have been under consideration and might still be closed in the following years as a way to streamline district operations and eliminate the deficit.
READ: Board Reinstates Full-Day Kindergarten in Close Vote
Of those three schools, Mary Drew is the closest to capacity at about 52 percent (Arbury Hills is at 41 percent, and Frankfort Square is at 34 percent) and has the district's highest percentage of students who meet and exceeds standards on state testing.
Mary Drew is connected to the district's administrative offices, which would be a selling point for parties interested in leasing the space, Murphy said. Also, it gives the district a better option if it should ever want to reopen the school if the economy recovers, Lenz said during the meeting.
How Much This Will Save
The baseline estimate the district would save by closing Mary Drew would be about $500,000, according to the model developed by Rains and her staff. This only factors in savings from section reductions, building overhead and district overhead and positions, the model shows. Although class-size maximums would not change, the model indicates there would be a 5 percent staff reduction with the closing.
Other factors that could affect this estimate but not factored in to the model include transportation costs and the rental of the building.
However, the board still has a long way to go to reaching its $1.4 million in cuts that it wants to achieve for the 2012-13 school year. With the closing of Mary Drew, the district only has created an estimated $800,000 in savings.
What About Teachers?
Board members were emphatic that Mary Drew teachers would move with the students, something many parents upset with the closing were skeptical about.
"The model says there's going to be a reduction in staff," said Ericka Soroko, who has two children who would have attended Mary Drew next year. "You can't tell me all of those teachers are going to be going to other schools."
But Murphy said any teacher reductions would not come only from Mary Drew, but it would be spread throughout the district. She also said that Mary Drew Principal Kathy Klein would not be let go from the district, but Murphy didn't know any specifics.
Earlier in Wednesday's meeting, the board announced the retirement of Hilda Walker Intermediate School Principal Jan Zevkovich, and one district resident suggested during public comments that board fill that open position with Klein.
READ: What's Cut, What's Not in the D161 Budget
Before the vote on closing Mary Drew was taken, Scott Smalter, president for Summit Hill's teachers' union, said the executive board met and decided against opening up the teachers' contract early. The contract expires at the end of the next school year, and a contractual pay increase in it is one of the contributing reasons the board is facing a tough financial situation.
Parent Reactions
District parents who attended Wednesday's meeting knew school closings were on the agenda, but many like Jen Vargas weren't prepared for Mary Drew to be the one to get the ax.
"I'm embarrassed to be a taxpayer in this community," said Vargas, a mother of five and president of the Athletic Boosters for Summit Hill Junior High and Hilda Walker Intermediate schools.
The possibility of closing Mary Drew was brought up in January, months after initial school closing discussions began centering around Arbury Hills and Frankfort Square elementary schools.
After the meeting, Soroko, who yelled, "Why didn't you listen to us before you made that decision?" before storming out, was visibly upset over the closing.
"I don't know what I'm going to tell my kids," she said, adding that she and other parents look at the people who worked and attended Mary Drew as family.
Soroko said she didn't think it was fair that supporters of the district's full-day kindergarten (Soroko would have supported cutting the program) were able to express their opposition to the idea at earlier board meetings. Mary Drew families didn't have the same forum because the final decision was sprung on them Wednesday, she added, admitting her feelings were biased and shaded by the fact that she had children in the school.
One parent, Tony Pietrzak, said Thursday he was organizing a group of parents that would petition the board to reconsider its decision on full-day kindergarten, as well as hire an outside consulting firm to develop the best financial plan for dealing with the district's $3 million projected deficit over three years. Pietrzak, who has two children that attend Mary Drew, also applied for the open board position recently filled by Denise Wildeveld.
"They're flying by the seat of their pants," said Pietrzak, who is against closing any school. "Not really listening to the community at the meetings. Not taking out advice. What do we do to make them listen."
What's Next?
Now, Rains and her staff will work on putting together the 2012-13 school year budget, hammering out the details of what will be cut before presenting it to the board. This also will include a plan on what needs to be done when it comes to Mary Drew's closing.
Also, the budget cut suggestions by Doyle, Perros and other board members will be reviewed and added to eliminating the $3 million deficit, Murphy said.
"I want to fill that pot as quick as we can without hurting the kids," she said. "They only get one chance to go through the system."
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41.524954-87.817101
ANALYSIS: What's Cut, What's Not in the D161 Budget
Mary Drew Elementary School20130 S Rosewood Dr, Frankfort, IL/articles/analysis-what-s-cut-what-s-not-in-the-d161-budget2022085/locations/6508480 -
Mary Drew Elementary School
20130 S Rosewood Dr, Frankfort, IL41.524954-87.817101Mary Drew Elementary School
20130 S Rosewood Dr, Frankfort, IL815-469-3950/listings/mary-drew-elementary-school2022085/locations/5481619 -
Arbury Hills School
19651 Beechnut Dr, Mokena, IL41.532873-87.848127Arbury Hills School
19651 Beechnut Dr, Mokena, IL708-479-2106/listings/arbury-hills-school325336/locations/481691 -
Frankfort Square School
7710 W Kingston Dr, Frankfort, IL41.525309-87.802596Frankfort Square School
7710 W Kingston Dr, Frankfort, IL815-469-3176http://frankfort.patch.com/listings/frankfort-square-school324357/locations/480708
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41.532873-87.848127
D161 Budget-Tightening Could Include Closing a School
Arbury Hills School19651 Beechnut Dr, Mokena, IL/articles/d161-budget-tightening-could-include-closing-a-school325336/locations/650878341.525309-87.802596D161 Budget-Tightening Could Include Closing a School
Frankfort Square School7710 W Kingston Dr, Frankfort, IL/articles/d161-budget-tightening-could-include-closing-a-school324357/locations/6508784 -
Hilda Walker Intermediate School
19900 80th Ave, Tinley Park, IL41.52965-87.811327Hilda Walker Intermediate School
19900 80th Ave, Tinley Park, IL815-464-2285/listings/hilda-walker-intermediate-school2008877/locations/5064981 -
Summit Hill Junior High School
7260 W North Ave, Frankfort, IL41.513534-87.79592Summit Hill Junior High School
7260 W North Ave, Frankfort, IL815-469-4330/listings/summit-hill-junior-high-school324369/locations/2278987 -
41.524954-87.817101
New Cost-Cutting Model Could Close Mary Drew School: Analysis
Mary Drew Elementary School20130 S Rosewood Dr, Frankfort, IL/articles/another-budget-tightening-option-could-mean-closing-mary-drew-school2022085/locations/650850741.532873-87.848127New Cost-Cutting Model Could Close Mary Drew School: Analysis
Arbury Hills School19651 Beechnut Dr, Mokena, IL/articles/another-budget-tightening-option-could-mean-closing-mary-drew-school325336/locations/650850841.525309-87.802596New Cost-Cutting Model Could Close Mary Drew School: Analysis
Frankfort Square School7710 W Kingston Dr, Frankfort, IL/articles/another-budget-tightening-option-could-mean-closing-mary-drew-school324357/locations/6508509
Actions Speaker Louder Than Words
8:45 am on Thursday, February 23, 2012
What a shame!!! I personally WILL NOT vote for any of the 4 board members that voted yes on this issues. I urge anyone in the community who does not agree with this decision to do the same. I get we need to got cost but I don't think this decision was well studied and thought out. I think other things could have been cut before closing a school which should have been the last resort. Terrbile leadership and they should be ashamed of themselves.
Rose C
8:16 pm on Saturday, February 25, 2012
@Actions - Why don't you come forward with your REAL name so we can scrutinize all of your actions, then if you look great on paper, we could vote for you next spring. That way when the hard decisions come up we can tell you that you should be ashamed of yourself for making the unpopular decision. Bottomline it's so easy to sit at your computer and complain - step into the hot seat, 4 of them will be up for election next spring. Then you could show us all how much smarter and what amazing leadership skills you have.
River Smith
10:38 am on Thursday, February 23, 2012
This is why they brought Wildeveld or however you spell her name in. Nice dirty politics. Bring in someone who will vote with you, not do the right thing for the children.
River Smith
10:39 am on Thursday, February 23, 2012
We can only hope that they will reverse their decision on this too.
Are you kidding me?
12:06 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
And to think all the ideas and suggestions that parents came up with over the past weeks...signatures on petitions...and the Board,Rains & Martin ignored ALL OF IT. It obviously was just a show to keep parents and taxpayers thinking their ideas would be heard. These 4 Board members need to go. And the next board meeting they are going to CUT more!!! They are not done yet. Please everyone ...watch what happens next, makes me mad that they are doing what they want. I cant wait till the market picks up and I can sell my house and move out of Frankfort!
Rose C
12:54 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
I doubt that the board & administration ignored all of the suggestions that the public shared. Do I think closing a school (any school) this year was a good idea? No. Are they going to end up cutting more at the next meetings - of course they are, the money isn't there. No fundraiser, business sponsorship or increased fees are ever going to bridge the deep gap that our district is in. It's so easy for all of us to sit out here & criticize. Somehow we found our way into this situation, & this board has to find away to keep us from slipping further into debt. All districts are feeling the pinch. The kids will adapt, parents need to come together & make it ok for them. @Are you kidding me - I hope the market picks up too, so you can move. It would be great if the people who purchase your home have constructive ideas rather than just destructive words.
Stella Nyder
12:46 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
I believe everyone on the Board has been so burdened with these difficult decisions
they are forced to make!!!
they are all passionate and stood true to their convictions.!!! I couldn't ask for anything more.!!!
I am so sorry to all the staff and Mrs. Klein. It sounds that they had a wonderful cohesive and special role in the life of our district. I remember how excited everyone was with all the blueprints etc of the new elementary school in 2007.
That was a confusing and overwhelming time however as I recall everyone was asked whether they wanted to stay at their school or go to Mary Drew... everyone was aqsked to submit this survey at IT! I was thinking about the kids back then too.
Having to move schools and leave their friends.!!! that was tough...but they all adjusted and came to love their new school. Now we need to adjust again and this wears on everyone.
Remember this is a new Board and new administration it will take a year to get through this transition.
Mrs Rains is right this is a very emotional time for everyone especially our students.
Lets all role model yet be genuine with them about our grief as well as support them...
these are life lessons for all of us. Change is hard!!! Life is hard!!!
I hope that we all can grow as a community and support one another fully..
I do believe Mrs.Kenny going over and over all the paperwork all these weeks with a heavy heart .Programming was not cut I am thankful for this!
LetsBeHonest
1:16 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
Well put Ms. Nyder. Though we are all sad to see a school close, we need to support our school board because they are doing the best job they can.
Rose C
12:56 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
Well said Ms. Nyder.
LetsBeHonest
12:57 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
Something needed to be done. Children can adjust to a building being cut. However, suggestions like "cut all activities" cannot be adjusted to. Alot of socially awkward children choose to be in clubs like Speech and Drama, those would have been included in this cut, as well as ALL clubs in the elementary schools. This is just a building, a building that a few short years ago parents were kicking a fit over it being built since it meant that their children would have to go to another school. Some of the same parents who were opposed to the kindergarten program being taken away were also opposed to the closing of this school, some of the same board members who fought to save the kindergarten program had to vote to close this school. I saw what happened in this meeting, all of you kicking a fit because our school (Mary Drew) got selected..would you have been among those who walked out if it was one of the other schools? Would you stand up and fight for Frankfort Square? Would you stand up and fight for Arbury Hills. To have my child come home from school and tell me that her friends say they don't want to go to school with the "dirty" frankfort square kids or the "snobby" rogus kids is ridiculous. These children donot pick these phrases up on their own, these things come out of their parents mouths. So I ask..What are you really fighting for? A building? Your children are all going to end up in the same pot, they will all attend 5th- 12th together.
Rose C
3:48 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
Well put LetsBeHonest! The parents' reaction - that their children will obsorb -will be the biggest factor in a successful transition.
LetsBeHonest
1:11 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
All those opposed to closing anything, where do you suppose we make cuts? Would you prefer we strip away the activities from our kids? Something needed to be cut. How can we ask parents to put an extra 150 dollars towards each child. Just to keep a building open? I have known families that have 6 kids in the summit hill school district at once. So your suggesting that they pay an extra 900 dollars to enroll their six children or that they admit they cannot afford that and sell candy or that we go to the businesses?! Are we panhandlers now? These suggestions though lovely are just not feasible.
LetsBeHonest
1:34 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
I agree some of the administrator costs should be cut, many of them receive benefits from their spouses. My only concern is how this will effect the male administrators. Is it fair (not to be sexist) but to say we cut their benefits when they have a family to provide for?
LetsBeHonest
1:45 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
Tracy, I agree with you. These things need to be taken under consideration as well
Are you kidding me?
1:20 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
Rose C, your assuming I have no idea what Im talking about. But everything I've said is true. I will continue to critize these board members when for the past 4 years members did NOT make the hard decisions that needed to be made. This financial mess was only addressed in November, where it should have been dealt with alongtime ago. Since 2007 the masses have cut back/shut downs, etc. Even LW has made major cuts, 8 million since 2007. SH161 has done nothing till this past November...this is poor management. This district deserves better than what we've been handed in the past 3 months. We have never had to close a school before in our district. Maybe if they would have been dealing with the obvious since day 1 we would not be critizing their decisions today.
Rose C
12:08 pm on Saturday, February 25, 2012
You do realize that 3 of those 4 board members you're referring to practically begged Mr. Pain and the other 4 members of the board to make some sort of cuts for this school year and they were ignored. The board now has their backs up against a wall. The money is running out. Just because you just started paying close attention over the past 3 months, does not mean they have not been working to find ways to make cuts. No we have never had to close a school before but having all of these buildings at half capacity is a waste of money too. I didn't want to see Mary Drew go - the evidence I heard sounded like IT should have been on the chopping block. Are you kidding me have you asked ANY of the board members directly about your concerns rather than just disparaging them on a website? If not, then you are just assuming that all of these 7 are at fault. www.whitepages.com - I think you can find all of their phone numbers there.
workingtogether
1:20 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
They will be effective if they are good teachers @Kelly. Districts in every town in this country shuffle teachers from one building to another each year as enrollment numbers shift even when all schools remain open. I agree they had to do something and I school closing is a much better option than cutting any program. I just wish they had waited a year and looked at the big picture. Questions like what happens the following year when we close another school(which seems to be likely) and we redistrict these kids again? I do think kids will handle these changes much better than the adults, but to keep changing boundries and switching schools will be an adjustment. Why not just wait a year and close both schools at once so the change is only once. Why not be 110% sure that the schools they are picking are the best in the long run. Does the income of renting out Mary Drew out weigh the cost of remoldeling FS or AH? I haven't seen the answers to these questions. I also think this community needs to STOP making false statements all over the internet. I have seen so many half truths! Striking fear in the community does not help. Some people have not been following the information until today and when you post class sizes will be 30 or that certain programs were said by the board to be unecessary or have no educational value yet are choosing to keep them over keeping a school open you get people all upset who don't know the truth of what has really been said by the board.
Rose C
3:55 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
I agree with most of what you are saying working together. What threw me last night was when a board member said that Indian Trail had $1million in renovations that woud need to be done over the next 5 years. It seems to me that those expenses far exceed any savings the district will get by closing Mary Drew.
River Smith
1:38 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
They need a finance director who can come in and save dollars in real places. How much waste is happening. How many of these board members were around when they agreed to this contract for the teachers...I'm all for the teachers getting paid b/c they are wonderful, but 5percent is too much and that should have been evident when this contract was made, a contract that the board agreed with and approved. Again, I think the teachers are deserving, but this should have never been an issue b/c no one had the ability to see in the future and plan it out. Simple math would have shown back then that these salaries were not going to be able to be covered. The recession didn't start this year, it was in place when this contract was put in to place. This is the boards fault and now we all have to suffer b/c of ignorance and a lack of ability to do simple math. Vote them out and let's get some qualified people in place that can save some real dollars and that can find real leaks in the system. I call for an outside finance group to come in and audit every aspect of our operation, trust me in that it would be money well spent.
LetsBeHonest
1:55 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
@kelly I agree!
River Smith
1:41 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
For example, how much are we paying in operational costs (electricity, phone, internet, water) and can we put systems into place to cut costs there. How much paper are we using? How much are we paying support staff and custodial help? How about insurance, have we looked at every possible avenue for employee insurance and how we could save money there. Tweeking plans in just the most minor way can save tons of money. How are we staffing our classroom and events,and are we seeing data that proves that the way we are doing is actually working and increasing test scores. Every penny spent needs to be scrutinized...EVERY PENNY. Conference and travel money should NO LONGER exist for anyone, including board members. This is a luxury we can no long provide. Transportation is another huge expense and it needs to be completely overhauled. It's not only about looking at what we currently spend and finding ways to cut, it's looking for those areas that are "Leaking and oozing" money and fixing those leaks. Trust me, there is money to be found.
LetsBeHonest
1:44 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
The board is a diverse and well put together group coming from different financial and academic background, and they well represent the community. They are not supposed to be unanimous on everything because we as a community are not unanimous on decisions, myself personally was very opposed to cutting the kindergarten program, but I understood something had to be cut. It was my child's school but I understood regardless of which school they chose. Those of you in past posts who have complained that some of the school board members shouldn't be on the board because they do not have children in the school district or because they are not educated are being ridiculous. A large part of our taxpaying community no longer has children in the school district, should their opinions no longer matter? A large part of out community did not attend a 4 year college. Their opinions are also not good enough for you correct? The board needs to be as diverse as it is because this is how the community is best represented.
LetsBeHonest
1:53 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
This district is the home. Not any individual school. These teachers, this district is their home, and even if we did not close a school their is no guarantee that all these teachers would have remained at our school.Teachers move from school to school every year. The quality education lies not in the building but in the teacher and there is no way the school board is going to cut their top teachers.
LetsBeHonest
2:04 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
Mary drew is a building, the teachers and student will adjust, and though there is a lot of pain right now, we the parents will also recover. I am also saddened by this decision, I didn't want to see any of these schools close, but I understood thing needed to be done. Would you fight as hard for any of the other 4 schools? Yesterday in the meeting after Mary Drew was announced half the room emptied. Our kids have another school to go to to, we survived before MD and we will survive after.
informed
2:20 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
@kelly, you said "We need to look within a start trimming that fat....restructure contracts with vendors, transportation, staffing, events, expenses for Admin should be cut". I have attended meetings it has been mentioned that these cuts are already on the table. So often you cannot open a contract in the middle of it.
workingtogether
2:39 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
Yes I would be okay with MD being a storage facility if that was what was best for our district and saved programs. Like I said before, I do not think they do know enough and should have waited a year and took the time to study what schools are the best to close, but that ship has sailed and we need to look towards the future and making future decisions that are good for the community. I get MD has high scores, but ask yourself why? Would they have the same test scores if they kept MD open and closed AH and sent all kids to MD and class sizes went from 15-18 to 20-22 like some of the other schools? Probably not, but they would still have really good test scores like the other schools. Why because WE HAVE GOOD PROGRAMS!!! Our district is good as a whole because of this. We need to keep that core and cutting programs like band, FDK, drama etc. will hurt the whole district. Closing a school will not hurt the whole district and kids will only react to what you as parents react to. If they are sad their school is closing it is b/c you as parents are making it an issue b/c I gurantee kids do not cry when they go from K to 1st to their new school or 4th to 5th at their new school. If you make it exciting just like you did that transistion the kids will be excited too. I still think there are lots of things that can be looked into that sadly, the board didn't do. Hopefully they will in the upcoming year.
LetsBeHonest
2:45 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
I am glad to see another person that though saddened by the circumstances, understands that things needed to be cut and it is better to loose a building than programming that would effect our kids.
taxpayer
3:48 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
Very well said "workingtogether. I don't see class sizes increasing since there is space at the other schools. If the grip is class sizes increasing at FS or AH, well then it should. Its not fair or right that IT, Rogus, and what was MD had class sizes at 22-23 while these smaller schools have 16-19 kids per class. The Board needs to make sure that they even out class sizes. Something had to be done, I too don't want to see programs cut. All our district is doing is going back to the way it was 4 years ago when we only had 4, 1-4 buildings. Once the dust settles, hopefully people will start to understand that closing a building was the right thing to do.
Hugetxbill
2:42 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
I believe more investigation needs to be done before school closings happen. It doesn't sound to me like they thought much further than cut full day kindergarten and 2 school closings. Everybody I know including myself and my spouse have had to remain flexible in our jobs and have even lost money because of this recession. I also work for an insurance company and I pay more for health insurance than the teachers do. I value our teachers, they help mold my children into a well rounded individual. What good is that if we can't afford to educate them? I'm not saying let the teachers take the cut, but I do agree every penny needs to be looked at and accounted for. This is not going to be popular with the teachers in the area, but why shouldn't you negotiate in contract? Everyone else in this recession has! Let us pay more for extracurricular activities, raise the registration fees a bit. Is it smart to close a school that cost multiple millions of $$$ to renovate just a few years ago than to close one that is considerably older? The board has had some tuff decisions, but I knew back in 2006 that we were heading toward a recession why weren't we planning appropriately? Why isn't the board listening to all of the suggestions given? How is that financial committee coming along?
Dan
3:12 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
Here we go----Wow, what as surprise, another school district in trouble and now the students, parents and taxpayers have to pay the price. The real reason is unsustainable labor agreements and administrator contracts. Here are a few examples...27% total wage increase plus cost of living for teachers. 100% paid medical and dental coverage. 17 paid sick/personal days per year which can be accumulated and then cashed out upon retirement(pension padding) Up to 30% salary increase plus cost of living and normal raises prior to retirement (pension padding) Up to $12,500.00 one time cash payment last year working before retirement(pension padding). Administrators get all of this plus some get more. The list goes on and on and is the biggest reason for district 161's problems. Again it is UNSUSTAINABLE WITHOUT HUGH FEE AND TAX INCREASES AND CUTTING OF STUDENT ACTIVITIES OR SCHOOL CLOSINGS. Soon parents will be taking student loans to send their kids to elementary, middle and high school. To be continued...
Are you kidding me?
5:00 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
Quoted from above: "Perros also questioned why Mary Drew was chosen, given how well the school had performed on state tests. He also asked why older schools, such as Arbury Hills or Indian Trails, weren't considered, saying Indian Trails faces about $1 million in repair work." AND WHY DID MARY K, DENISE L, DENISE W. & JOY M. VOTE TO CLOSE DREW AFTER THIS SCHOOL WAS RENOVATED JUST A FEW YEARS AGO? Next meeting, they need to vote to close Trail if $1 Million in repairs are expected.
get real
3:12 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
Do think the board gets together and says"let's make decisions that will piss off the community and cause the most chaos".? Of course they don't! We may not agree with their decisions but I honestly think they do what they think is best!! They are not out to "get anyone". No matter what they have to cut, no one will be happy. It is aweful times.
LetsBeHonest
4:20 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
well put!
Mokena Mom
3:20 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
Wow , I sure miss the days with Dr.Middleton.
informed
3:29 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
I miss Dr. Middleton too. He was fair - NO drama
Frustrated
4:32 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
I agree that some major cuts have to be made and that they will not make everyone happy, but I don't think that Rains provided the board with enough detailed information to justify the closing of Mary Drew. And if two schools will ultimately need to be closed, why not wait until next year and handle all of the moving and redistricting at one time. In that time frame, the new finance director can determine all of the details of the savings and reach out to community colleges and the park district to see who may be interested in what buildings. All that was provided was the savings in staff reductions and overhead. What about the cost of moving, increases in transportation costs, ongoing maintenance of the building and grounds, etc.? I know the board is faced with very difficult decisions, I just wish that they would make those decisions based on good information. Mary, Denise, Denise & Joy thinking that Rains and Gerdes provided them with enough information is a problem in and of itself. They can't even recognize that the information that they were given wasn't complete.
As for MD, I believe that dividing that staff among the different schools will be a mistake. Klein was able to do something there that she wasn't able to do at Trail. They developed a synergy that is probably greater than the sum of its parts and if they get split up, they may not be able to recreate that success. And I say that without having any students at that school.
workingtogether
7:24 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
It wouldn't have lasted forever anyway. Teachers would come and go eventually causing a disruption to this "synergy". Again a big factor to the success besides our districts stong academic programs is the small class sizes at this school. Without that the success would be similar to other schools in the district. Cutting our programs, specialists should be a last resort. These great teachers work well together because they are great. They will be great anywhere. I think we need to help this board see other options for the upcoming year so that more mistakes are made. Making up petitions to cut FDK another academic program is a mistake. Lets not take programs away from our kids. Once you weaken those pillars they will all start to come down and our kids academic success will be impacted!
Connie
5:24 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
This decision was made to hastily, This was no different than fdk, part of why they voted to keep fd was because people weren't informed. How many of MD parents weren't informed of this. I agree, it was on the agenda to discuss closing a school. Nothing was mentioned about voting to close one. And again why MD? Is it fair now that Rogus and Indian Trail will be affected but Frankfort Square and Arbury won't be. When they changed the boundaries, kids from Arbury went to Rogus, why aren't those kids going back to Arbury? Fair is Fair! All of the facts should have been presented as to what school would be best to close. If after all the facts it was MD then so be it, but I don't think that would be the consensus. The fact that Mary Kenny wouldn't even look at the ideas the board came up with was wrong. She said flat out last night that she wanted MD closed. Her personal agenda, not the best interest for the district, and Joy is just the puppet and agrees. Kudos to George, Sean and Stacey for asking for the data! It is sad that questions weren't addressed and answers given to the community. Barb says she takes her direction from the board, and the board says they take their direction from the superintendent. So I guess nothing gets accomplished this way. Every avenue should have been looked at before this decision was made. They acted in haste! Have they once ever asked the teachers what they can cut in their own schools? NO! Again, get all facts before a decision is made!
LetsBeHonest
5:49 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
How do you know these kids are not going back to Arbury? No one but the board and superintendent know anything about the boundaries yet. You are jumping to conclusions, and doing so in an open forum like this is going to create rumors that escalate. Like rumors that there are 30 kids in classes next year. Rumors. All rumors. These things raise hysteria in parents and it is just unnecessary. You don't even know what your talking about, no one knows the information your spewing out except the super and I am sure these things are still in discussion.
1Mom
9:13 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
Letsbehonest It was said that boundary lines would revert to the ones prior to Mary Drew. Students from Mary Drew were never zoned for Arbury Hills.
Rose C
11:15 am on Saturday, February 25, 2012
Connie, I'm very confused by all of your posts. From what I've read, before the FDK vote you tore into certain members of the board for wanting to convert to half day. You got FDK (a decision which I completely agreed with). Now you are upset about a school closing (again, I think they needed more info) but my question to is you - what would make you happy? It seems that you won't accept any cuts at all unless it doesn't have any direct impact on you. So I say to you where do you think significant cuts can be made? I agree that the community doesn't have all of the facts, however the job of a school board is to analyze everything. They don't have to agree with each other, but they do take an oath to do the work. Unless you have some evidence that they are sitting around laughing about pissing off the community, I think it is time for you to do your homework rather than just spout off about things that you just started paying attention to because it will directly impact you. Were you there March 2011 when 4 members of the board refused to make any cuts while 3 were practically begging for them because they saw the writing on the wall? Just like your federal & state legistlatures - these board members have phone numbers that you can call, have you tried that, or is it just easier to sit behind you computer and make assumptions about people you don't even know.
cynthia
7:17 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
Of course the board and the superintendent are the only ones who know about the boundaries! They are the only ones with the secret info... the info the public does not even get to see or hear about!! Stop sticking up for these people. They know what they are doing, and when election time comes believe me the community will be there!!! Mark my words they had plans for Mary Drew all along!! 843 will take it!! They didnt want Square or Trail! Its a shame, bring on the elections!
informed
7:04 am on Friday, February 24, 2012
Correct me if I'm wrong wasn't FDK voted on first, that didn't happen so they went to their next option (that the supt. showed us two months ago). How is this an agenda? It looks like their agenda is to cut the budget, that is the job
of a school board member. guess what ? it's the job of any elected official.
They made a tough cut - that something even our government CAN'T do.
Rose C
11:19 am on Saturday, February 25, 2012
Cynthia - any information can & must be released to the public in accordance to the Freedom of information act. I love your 'these people' - do you know them or is this another instance of people making assumptions about people they don't know. They all have names, phone numbers, emails, different professional backgrounds and children of all different ages. What do they say about people who assume?
LetsBeHonest
8:02 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
Yes it was.
taxpayer
8:29 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
@Are you kidding me? Are you honestly suggesting closing another school with a population as large as Rogus (minus a few kids)? I'm sorry but thats insane. We will definately see class sizes increase. That would be ALOT of kids to redistribute and will definately affect class sizes.
Are you kidding me?
6:34 am on Friday, February 24, 2012
taxpayer, I only quoted what G. Perros said at the meeting. Trail has estimated $1 Million in repairs in the near future...fact. Where are they gona come up with that Million?? That's insane!
taxpayer
9:32 am on Friday, February 24, 2012
The bigger the school, the more costly repairs will be. There is no way in gods earth that all the kids from Trail can fit into FS. Aubury and Rogus are too far. Every single kid in that school would be bussed. I've been to board meetings where its been discussed. I believe that 1mil. is being inflated ALOT. Their phone system needs to be updated. The sad part is, I think only Rogus and MD are up to code. Instead of dumping millions into rehabing and opening MD, the board should have used that money on our existing buildings that are outdated. Again, poor spending and bad financial decisions from our Board.
LetsBeHonest
8:32 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
As much as I love the blue jays, and Mrs. Klein is a phenomenal principal, Arliss is an amazing staff member, I know that we can move forward from this and the day that the board cuts a fantastic administrator like Klein is when I will loose truly faith in this district.
workingtogether
9:30 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
Also all of our schools are scoring between 91 and 98 percent. Notice all schools running at 40 percent occupancy are the highest scorers...coincidence I think not. You are splitting hairs over 7 percentage points. These are all amazing scores and it is because of our high academic standards not because "Mary Drew makes our district looks good". Cut this programs and all children in our district suffer. Is that really more important than a couple of schools scoring a few percentage points higher than the rest of the schools in the district. I honestly think that is a sad view point.
Connie
9:38 pm on Thursday, February 23, 2012
@letsbehonest, I am not jumping to conclusions. I am going with the facts. Mary Drew consisted of kids from Rogus and Indian Trail. So that is where those kids will go back to, There was no mention of changing the boundaries for any other school. So how am I jumping to conclusions, and spewing out information. I have been at these board meetings. I agree with Kelly this is a place to discuss how we feel not to have someone try to belittle you. I would not put something on here that wasn't true. Have you ever heard them talk about moving kids to other schools other than Rogus, IT and Mary Drew, NO! It has never been mentioned to move kids to Arbury or Frankfort Square. I am not saying that they may not change their minds, but it was never discussed. There is so much that hasn't been discussed!!!!! This is the exact reason why MD should not be closed. The data/facts have not been discussed! That is the issue here, that a decision was made without having all of the facts compiled. I also thought that it was interesting that no where on the agenda did it specifically say that they were discussing the Closing of a school. It only said planning for the future. How dishonest!!!!! If it was on the agenda or people knew that a school was definately being closed last night, that room would have been packed with people from all schools. That was just conveniently not put on the agenda. Again, shame on them!!!!
taxpayer
9:40 am on Friday, February 24, 2012
Connie, I respect your posts and you are spot on most of the time. What I am not understand is the part where you said "If it was on the agenda or people knew that a school was definately being closed last night, that room would have been packed with people from all schools". This statement ticks me off to no end. Most people in our community only go to meetings when they feel a decision will directly impacts their child. 161 parents need to start attending board meetings, not only when they feel a decision will impact their child.
Connie
6:22 am on Friday, February 24, 2012
If you were at that meeting on Wed, Mary Kenny specifically stated that she never wanted Mary Drew open and wanted it closed. She said she would close it now if she could! Tell me that isn't a personal agenda?
Are you kidding me?
6:28 am on Friday, February 24, 2012
Connie, you are so right! She's not the only one with a personal agenda either.
workingtogether
7:26 am on Friday, February 24, 2012
I agree with this! I have said it over and over that I think it is wrong to close the school without more research, but I also think the statements you are making Kelly are not productive and are wildly offensive to the rest of the teachers, staff, students and parents of this district. Those test scores are one small thing in a big picture. Part of that big picture is that this school district has great programs and a great curriculum. You can not have such a tough curriculum when you start taking out this programs and that is what the board is talking about doing if they do not close schools. Kids need these art programs, tutoring and reading specialist. When they do not have them the burden falls only on the classroom teacher and in turn changing what can be done with the rest of the class. I do not think taking these programs away and leaving schools open is a reasonable solution. I get you love the school and that is great and I do not fault you that, but you are making statements that are skewed. I ask you to look at this district as a whole and what it is doing for our chidren, which is great things. Your children do have a right to be upset, but they are taking cues from you too. It is a shame you do not see that even though many of us don't agree with the board we have to pick up and move on together. Sending out petitions to take away more of our programs to keep a school open isn't right. We need to help find alternatives that don't involve that.
Connie
7:41 am on Friday, February 24, 2012
I absolutely think this decision was done in haste! Barb even said at the meeting that they have 3 years and a drastic decision didn't have to be made. I don't think all of the facts were presented to the community, and that is the sad part. We put our trust in these people to be honest and make the right decisions. I just think there have been too many times that wrong decisions have been made because these issues haven't been discussed and research hasn't been done!
Actions Speaker Louder Than Words
8:42 am on Friday, February 24, 2012
I am not sure how everyone knows exactly how these kids will be split up and placed when I received the following e-mail from Rains:
"Following the announcement of the closure of Mary Drew School last night, several questions are surfacing about where current Mary Drew School students will be attending school next fall. I will continue to collect questions from parents and staff through the rest of this week and then develop a Q&A over the weekend to be e-mailed to the entire school community on Monday morning. In the meantime, I appreciate your patience as we move through this process."
Bottom line board voted on something passed and really doesn't have a plan in place yet. How can they feel good about themselves leaving these poor childern and families in limbo? Nobody should pass judgement on how these childern are feeling unless you are in their shoes. Just like adults all childern will react differently.
taxpayer
9:57 am on Friday, February 24, 2012
Common sense would tell me that those kids would go back to their original home school. Some of the kids taken from IT to fill MD were within walking distance to Indian Trail, but were then bused to MD. Redrawing boundry maps cost money, sadly, if they are going to do just that, then their best bet is to close school #2 this year and do it all at once. I don't want to see bombs dropped on our heads every year for the next 3 yrs. Just do it and get it over with.
Hugetxbill
8:51 am on Friday, February 24, 2012
Ok, so we are going to close a school that is up to code? Does that mean the other schools are not? Our children are housed in a school that is not up to code and no one is alarmed by this? The board has not used our money wisely and continues to make rushed decisions. We do need an outside consultant to review where the money is/going. Indian Trails needs $1 million in improvements. Is there going to be an open bid? I read the Mary Drew recon was $39 million . . . who padded their pockets there? Something stinks around here. Are we going to rehab another building that will be closed next year? Stop the board before they waste more of our money!
Hugetxbill
8:59 am on Friday, February 24, 2012
Just read from Joe Vince there is an outside audit every year . . . no issues found . . . hmmmmm.
taxpayer
10:03 am on Friday, February 24, 2012
Maybe the board does this when getting bids, I don't know but I have heard a few people mention that what they need to do, and should do is get bids from tradesmen within our community to do work on our schools. Plumbers, roofers, electricians, construction workers, etc. THOSE are the people that will give back to the community, NOT outside companies that just look at $$.
Hugetxbill
10:12 am on Friday, February 24, 2012
I have done a lot of research on the Mary Drew project and it is very difficult to find information on this. However, I am mistaken with that number $39 million I believe is a total number for the renovations for summit hill, hilda walker and mary drew. The round about number according to an archived newspaper is around $9 million-still a lot of money considering they want to close it now.
informed
9:23 am on Friday, February 24, 2012
@hugetxbill, $39 million to recon Mary Drew...next time research your facts
Donny
10:00 am on Friday, February 24, 2012
this is outstanding! i've got my popcorn, keep this going please!
Actions Speaker Louder Than Words
10:01 am on Friday, February 24, 2012
Taxpayer---- the key word is "Common Sense". According to the e-mail sent by Rains herself boundary and school assigment has not been set in stone.
informed
10:45 am on Friday, February 24, 2012
@actions speak louder than words - Of course NOT, the decision was made Wednesday...do you think she has a magic wand. Alot of posters on this blog are unreasonable.
informed
4:47 pm on Friday, February 24, 2012
@Connie, anyone can gather a petition....it's not a secret the board has been given several petitions over the past few months. It's becoming standard practice of this community...petitions mean nothing, doesn't seem like the board pays attention to them.
Connie
6:30 pm on Friday, February 24, 2012
Yes, I am aware that anyone can gather a petition. But why take the chance of it backfiring. They very easily could say ok, we will cut fdk and also decide to keep MD closed. I for one do not want to see both of these happen!
Are you kidding me?
5:52 am on Saturday, February 25, 2012
Since they choose to ignore recent petitions...maybe we should (maybe someone already has) to have certain board members impeached.
informed
7:08 am on Saturday, February 25, 2012
@Are you kidding me? ".maybe we should (maybe someone already has) to have certain board members impeached."
REALLY? Are you freaking serious? Go ahead Einstein, get busy....you have an assignment your job is to spearhead your wonderful idea we'll sit back and see how far you get.
Are you kidding me?
8:08 am on Saturday, February 25, 2012
OK informed, thanks for the motiviation, challenge accepted.
Inside The Box
8:16 am on Saturday, February 25, 2012
Wow ! What a wonderful idea. I know Illinois has strict "election recall" rules, but they do have provisions for impeachment which are much simpler. Sounds like a wonderful Challenge.....Your On !!
informed
8:26 am on Saturday, February 25, 2012
@tracy, @donny and @Kelly Meister, any more room on that couch? We have a new reality TV drama to enjoy "The Impreachment of the Summit Hill school board"....I'll bring my own popcorn.
Inside The Box
10:25 am on Saturday, February 25, 2012
For those interested: (sure hope they keep "all" records)
Requirements of the Illinois Open Meetings Act (School Board Meetings)
http://www.iasb.com/law/schboardmeetings2010.pdf
Requirements of the Illinois Freedom of Information Act (School Board Records)
http://www.iasb.com/law/schboardrecords2010.pdf
Rose C
11:59 am on Saturday, February 25, 2012
I have a feeling that if you were successful at impeaching any of the board members, they would happily hand over their seat to you - then you can be ostracised for the tough decisions, or have your 'friends' try to influence your decision or talk smack behind your back about what they thought you would do, or assume you took the postion because you have some sinister agenda or are receiving kickbacks. The upside to that would be that you could see first hand the real mess that has led us here. No one wants to hear the board say that we're in this mess because of decisions made by previous boards or Mr. Pain. I find this laughable. Everyone is now paying attention but only to things that will effect them. There's a big picture here people - it consists of 3400 students. Our educational programs need our focus. I'm sad that any building is being closed. But we need to be realiztic about what we're facing. Hiring attorneys - yes, not the best kept secret ever - will only further hurt the district. So money that would be spent on the kids will now be spent on attorney fees. Kudos to whoever came up with that one. Looks like we'll have to pass a referrendum to pay for our legal fees rather than programs that are good for the kids. You all realize that anyone considering moving to this district can just google 161 & see the hot mess & complete lack of facts & assumptions...it's this childish behavior that makes us all look bad.
Connie
2:01 pm on Saturday, February 25, 2012
@ Rose, you are correct, this district is in a hot mess and no one will move into this area. Hence the reason that this school board should have had all of their facts in place and presented everything to the community before a decision was made. Who will move into this area knowing that they make these hasty decisions. It absolutely makes us all look bad. These decisions are tearing apart out community instead of bring us together.
Rose C
8:53 pm on Saturday, February 25, 2012
Connie- the past few meetings are the first EVER to be attended by more than just a handful of community members. Every meeting board members receive information. Ask any of them. This voluntary position - because of the state of the district - has turned in to a full time unpaid job. At this point every decision is tearing our community apart because people are acting any decision is one step closer to disaster. Has the community done all of their homework? Again, I think there was no evidence showing that MD or any other school needed to be closed this year. But I have to ask the community that is outraged - did you vote last April? If you didn't vote - which less than 25% of our community did - don't they say you have no right to complain, we brought this on ourselves.
Citizen
10:59 pm on Saturday, February 25, 2012
Rose, I think we can all agree that previous administrations lack of planning have contributed our current crisis. That being said, this board has also spent carelessly-the most obvious example would be the ISS teachers. Even more glaring than the wasteful spending is the lack of planning. We should have been looking for answers to the budget issues long before December. At the last meeting it was announced that the HW Principal will be retiring early. Many in the community feel the the board will not offer a contract to the Principal of Frankfort Square, (she also may choose to retire early) or the SHJH Principal, I believe both of these women are tenured and will have to be offered jobs within our district. Does anyone know what the early retirements will cost our district? Are any other administrators considering the early retirement option?
The largest line on my tax bill goes to Summit Hill District 161- I have the right to complain!
Stella Nyder
8:35 am on Sunday, February 26, 2012
Good Morning Everyone,
I am happy that the Board has heard your concerns by your persistence and I hope all the issues will be addressed prior to re-voting.
Is anyone thinking of how this would impact the Mary Drew Kids?
ILast week, the Principal held an assembly to inform the students of MD pending closure. If the Board votes differently now having to tell students that their school isn't closing after all.
This confusing and mixed message causes them to feel unsafe.This tells them that the authority figures in their life arn't trustworthy(Board and Administration vs.the Mary Drew community).This dynamic happens in dysfunctional families and it is called splitting!
My message to parents who are meeting to give a "united" front.
I am asking you to fight fair as you are a part of the district community and your agenda will impact all of us. Please BE RESPECTFUL of our elected officials and especially BE RESPECTFUL at the special meeting.(talk of impeachment, news media,getting the state involved,filing a grievance,shouting during Board meetings,storming out, interrupting, accusing and being unkind.)
I personally will not be present at the special meeting on Tues., I do not want to get emotionally upset and lose sleep because of potential inappropriate outbursts and disruptive behavior from community members!
Would you expose your child to a potentially volatile Board meeting? I would not!
taxpayer
9:12 am on Sunday, February 26, 2012
Well said Stella. So, I say to everyone going to protest the closing of MD, I sure do hope you have a better plan then closing schools, and present that to the board. Going to the board meeting, and listing why you think closing MD isn't going to fill the 3mil. hole we are in. Not a single school is at capacity or close to it. Schools need to be closed. Fighting to keep MD open, and closing a different school is only going to shift the anger to another set of parents, and upset another group of kids. So if they change their mind and keep MD open, then what? This craziness needs to end. Parents of this community need to come together for the sake of our children.
Our Board needs to make tough decisions which are not going to make everyone happy. The Board isn't closing schools to be spiteful, or to purposly tick of the community, they are doing it because its necessary. What I hope to gain out of going to the meeting is learning as to WHY MD was chosen, and what their plan for that empty school, anything more than that is a bonus.
taxpayer
9:16 am on Monday, February 27, 2012
@Tracy, I also understand that your petition isn't about higher taxes. Others have suggested that, and that is the route the Board will try and go THIS YEAR if true cuts are not made.
DIst 161 Parent
6:52 pm on Monday, February 27, 2012
Taxpayer, well said on all points AND for being respectful while posting. This crusade to keep Mary Drew open will not help our district. Mary Drew has been open for 4 years. The students will go to the schools they were originally zoned for. Something has to give. Cutting activities, specials and raising fees does NOT benefit ALL children in the district.
taxpayer
10:26 pm on Monday, February 27, 2012
Thank you, and thank you for seeing the big picture. If the revote goes a different direction, I fear they will close sections, cut teachers and go with higher class sizes. Then ALL children in the district will suffer, all so we can continue to maintain 5 buildings that are at 60% capacity or lower. I understand emotions are running high and no one wants their home schools closed but 2 schools will eventually go and it will be the community against each other preaching as to why their school is better than the one next door. It breaks my heart.
Connie
2:27 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012
Just remember, this will affect every student and every school in our community. Don't think because your school is not closing that they will not increase class size. they will be filling class sizes to guidelines. So across the board 1-4 class sizes are going to be higher. I am not a fan of a referendum, but again, I would rather pay a few extra hundred dollars on my tax bill that to have more kids in a class and pay more in all of the fees. You have multiple kids in multiple clubs etc, you will wind up paying more than the referendum. Also, remember they may not be done, who is to say that they don't close a school next year again, and all of our kids get moved to another school. So for some kids, that is 3-4 schools just for elementary school. I don't want to see programming cut either. I just think it is easier to swallow a referendum before a school closes than after a school closes. Something to think about. Please come to the meeting tonight, again, it's about everyone of us in this community. Don't think because your school wasn't on the chopping block it won't be affected. It is sad that it has come to this, but it will get worse before it gets better!
taxpayer
2:47 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012
Please remember that our schools hold 4,200 students and our enrollment is at 3,400 students. That is 800 open spaces in our schools. Wrong facts are putting people in fear. People need to remember that closing a school or 2 will not increase class sizes, we have the room. Closing sections, increasing class sizes and cutting teachers was talked about by the Board to close the budget gap. They can do this if a school is closed or not. Increased class sizes doesn't need to happen, and the board said that they want to do this as a last resort. This will be OUR LAST RESORT if a school isn't closed. 1/2 occupied buildings is not acceptable to me. I would gladly vote for a referendum once a school or 2 are closed. I will however vote for a referendum before I want to see class sizes increased.
Connie
3:46 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012
Class sizes will increase to the guidelines at all schools. Gone are the days of 17, 18, 20 in a class. They will be moving kids to the buildings that have lower class sizes. Some won't be affected because they already have the max in their classes, but for those schools that don't have as many kids, the class sizes will increase. This will fill rooms, and cut back on teachers. So while we have all of these empty class rooms, remember those also include the science labs, music rooms and art rooms. I don't want to see my kids get less of a music class or art class because the teacher doesn't have a classroom to teach in. I don't know about you, but I wouldn't want to be a displaced teacher. Yes, there are rooms at all schools, but again, they are cutting staff, and that means classes will be at the guidelines.
Serioulsy?
4:22 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012
@Connie -- How do you have so much information about what is going to happen? Do you have a friend on the board or have you talked to Mrs. Rains? Was this in the handouts because I thought the last model that was presented said they weren't going to raise class sizes to guidelines (25 for 1st & 2nd, 27 for 3rd and 4th)? Inquiring minds would like to know so if you can point me to where I can check out this info I'd appreciate it. Thanks.
Joe Vince
4:35 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012
@A Concerned Parent:
I think there's some confusion of terms here. The board has said they are not raising the classroom size maximums. Actual class sizes will be raised in some cases, but that's because they haven't reached their maximums. I think some people are confusing the two.
Joe Vince
Local Editor, Frankfort
Connie
5:01 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012
they discussed at a board meeting that they would make classrooms meet district guidelines. Joe is correct. Some classrooms have not reached their maximums. So again, classes will get bigger. And from what they have said, all schools will be affected. Kids are going to move to all schools to even them out and fill the classrooms. They will not go over district guidelines, but will go up to the maximum.
Serioulsy?
5:13 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012
So, what are the class size maximums? Are they the ones presented on the model (25 for 1st & 2nd and 27 for 3rd & 4th) or were those what they were going to raise them up to if they didn't close a school?
taxpayer
4:23 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012
I spoke directly with Barb Rains regarding the additional rooms. They DONOT include music, science, art rooms, computer rooms, specials etc. Those rooms are spoken for. What she has listed on her chart, of how many classrooms are available at each school, are accurate according to her. Also, the only schools that have such low class sizes are Aubury Hills and FS. The only school that will see class sizes increase should be FS. AH will remain small. Not sure where your child goes to school but Rogus, IT, and MD have around 20-23 students in a class. This is the norm. 16-18 kids in a class is what private schools offer, not a public school. I don't mean this in a mean way, and I do feel bad for any teacher that needs to be let go but I'm sorry, so many people in our district have lost their jobs, and are struggling to make ends meet. The unemployed in our community cannot continue to pay out of their ears,and make sacrifices just to keep some teachers employed. This economy sucks, and most who have a job realize that at any given moment, you could be let go for cost saving reasons. This is just a fact of life nowadays
taxpayer
4:27 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012
Sorry for the error, I ment to say that All special classrooms are included in Barbs chart. The additional classrooms she has listed is what is actually available.
Serioulsy?
4:56 pm on Tuesday, February 28, 2012
@Taxpayer and @Joe Vince -- thanks for the information. It is so confusing trying to dissect everyone's comments to figure out what is fact and what is he said/she said information. BTW, my daughter went to FS last year and there were 26 kids in her 4th grade class. Also, I know for a fact that there are 20-22 kids in each 3rd and 4th grade class this year but I'm not sure about 1st and 2nd. Hopefully there will be more factual information coming soon from the district. Again, my thanks.